Tens of thousands of years ??

This is one lecture I would have loved to listen to. What are the chances that his talk will be recorded and a txt version, at the least, posted by your site? It would be a great favor. Rare Book Society of India

Hey Nimisha you may want to read this too.

Roshan Iyer

Great waiting to attend...

Is there any entry fee?

No. All are welcome.

Thank you will be there

Thanks to Rare Book Society of India for this... Wanting to meet your team..

This lecture has been arranged by the Rotary Club of Bangalore for Raj Vedam. RBSI is glad to help spread the word around.

Would it be possible for to organize this lecture in Coimbatore?

Meera Iyer

History is rising from every corner. Other subjects should follow suit.

Thanks for your interest. On July 15th, I presented this work at Arsha Vidya Gurukulam in Anaikatti, Coimbatore, Despite several efforts, we were not able to organize a talk in Coimbatore city that day.

Thanks for your interest. A recording will be made available on "IHAR Channel" on YouTube.

Thanks for giving me the info....Plz do let me know when it will become available. After I have heard you, I might have questions and hopefully you will be willing to discuss your research :)

interesting

Hi would you all be webcasting this lecture? It would be great if we could watch it on YouTube, specially for those who can't attend.

Thanks for your interest. Unfortunately, I don't have control over the logistics this evening for webcasting. However, will make every effort for a HD video recording, and archive it on "IHAR Channel" on YouTube.

Happy to know about RBSI & Raj Ved..I would like to inform about my research which is appreciated by all the National & international scholors.. please Google "Bshtappaih " .and watch my interview on "cautious mind ,"you tube."discussion on Hampi Mahahopura..I will be glad if any such organisations take interest in it..

Thanks a lot

Stop saffronization of history.

Kindly upload video on YouTube. We are from other city

Great post

The people who accuse others of 'saffronization' of Indian history are themselves guilty of 'crimsonization' of the same. So let us allow different versions to coexist and lean towards what we find to be true.

Rare Book Society of India the rhetoric of "let us allow different versions to coexist" is always resorted by those who don't want one single truth to prevail at any time. It is also used by proponents of Intelligent Design. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intelligent_design

It's a working day and as a history buff and the mother of a child who has projects to do in History, I would like to connect with the speaker and the society, offline. Would that be possible?

You missed my point. There is no 'intelligent design' behind it. Not allowing another version is not even intelligent in my opinion. History only shows how different ideologies only keep getting replaced by one another all the time. And my dear Sir...there is no single truth.

You missed my analogy. Just like the 'intelligent design' proponents want it taught in parallel to evolution, you want saffron history to be taught in parallel to the truth. History needs to be freed from relativists.

I see your well meaning point Nikhil Joshi. But you have to understand that history has always been relative. And how do you know what is truth?? And how can you presume that the 70 year old Marxist version is the 'truth' and every other version is not. That is a patently disturbing and frightening presumption. And an appalling level of intolerance towards a narrative that poses a challenge. But yet, each version always depends on the status and position of the writer. And each is equally true. There is another name for a 'single version' and that is 'propaganda'. The Marxists have in effect distorted Indian history for their own selfish purposes in the name of scientific approach for the past 70 years. The Colonialists did that for the 100 years before them. Now for the first time we are seeing a rediscovery of India through the Hindu eyes which quite seamlessly resonates with the people of this land...so let it be.

You may very well refute the Marxist or the Colonialist perspective by them peeling off from the truth. But to impose Hindu perspective is jingoist. For instance, why do you refuse Aryan migration theory? Why don't south Indians have fair skin or blue eyes as commonly as the north Indians?

The history of India is not written in JNU or Lutyens - it is written in the millions of villages with their own Puranas, parables and poems. That is where the soul of India resides.

Why are you shifting from saffron perspective to the subaltern one now?

Nikhil Joshi: Do all members of your family have the exact same features and complexion? Let alone your community, your village, your town, city, state, region and the country. And are all North Indians fair complexioned?

And racial intermixing in a land as ancient as India is as natural a process as salt in sea water. Why should all look the same.

Did I expect ALL to have same features? It is a fact that blood relatives do share common features and complexion.

Genealogically distant relatives DO look more dissimilar than close family members. In SPITE of racial intermixing, the features of sub-groups are identifiable separately.

Maybe you answered your own question.

Unfortunately I will miss

Let me end this discussion with the thought that we should be open to entertain different versions of history as there is no 'single truth'.

Great insight into actual Indian History

And we are back to square one! Those who don't have evidence or arguments to establish their opinions as the universally acceptable truth want to appeal all to be 'open to entertain different versions of history'.

You seem to be quite entrapped in your ideological viewpoint. This talk essentially gives evidence and basis for his version. Do read the write up. It's the Marxist versions who unquestioningly lapped up the Colonial narratives. RBSI does not stand for any particular ideology or political leaning. There are enough and more academic bodies to do that. The posts here reflect all versions and ideas if you ever have the patience to sift through them.

The problem with ad-hoc historians is that while they say they have evidence to support their theories but for some reason never publish in a peer reviewed journal. They know they'd be decimated by professional historians.

Peer reviewed - you pat my back and I will pat yours. Let's face it...there is a club out there. As a person interested in history I find many theories propounded by 'experts' almost incredible if not outright laughable. But then...it's their version.

Translated as, "The system is rigged because I can't defend what I am saying"

No point when the match has been fixed.

Or you're actually very bad at playing the game.

There is no game here.

You used the metaphor I carried it forward.

No offence, I really love your page. Loved the recent posts on William Simpson.

And I very rarely engage myself in FB debates.

http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/duty_calls.png

It is high time that the nonsense peddled by Indologists and Marxist historians is discarded and an honest quest to pursue our history is encouraged. History is not a science -- one can never be sure about it. A true historian is always cognizant of this fact. Marxist historians clearly aren't. For them, historical truth is absolute and they operate within that framework.

Nikhil Joshi...Would you please define what you mean by saffronization of history. Is the re-discovery of Saraswati river an example of that. Is the debunking of Aryan Invasion Theory that?

Yes @jay shankar, Aryan invasion is a fact. Aryan religion came from a common proto religion shared with Zoroastrianism.

Anirudh Kanisetti!

Thanks , I now know that Rare Book Society is all about creating history from mythology

The argument has already started, even before the talk :) Rare Book Society of India, I have one correction for you on something you said above, and I quote: "we should be open to entertain different versions of history as there is no 'single truth'. This needs to be corrected...as per Vedas and Upanishads, the Hindu Gyan....there is only One Truth. Especially in History. It either happened or did not. Historical events are one....interpretations of evidence available are multiple. In fact, as many views as Rulers. Each came and distorted the facts to their own benefit....pyramids were destroyed, statues and buildings were razed, races of people were wiped off, ancient human was very cruel....and of course TIME wiped out much too.....plus, all court historians were writing their own version of the History.....etc etc etc. All this makes it difficult for present day historians and sincere scholars to tease out the truth from false...I think, and I am sure you will agree. But honestly, we not want another tainted version....because, a version is only a version....yours vs his vs mine vs theirs vs ours. Scholars put in hrs of work in research to figure things out and we need to be patient and open minded to hear them out. So, I am all ready set to listen to what Mr. Raj Vedam has to present and hopefully his evidence will convince us all, and if we have questions, hopefully he will accept those gracefully and answer them for us. Thanks for creating this opportunity though :) :) peace be with all of us.

BTW, how do we get on that IHAR channel, do we need to subscribe, be a member or something?

Nikhil Joshi: This is a well researched presentation by Raj Vedam. Video Lecture: Indian Civilization: Genetic History of India Part 1 Raj Vedam of Indian History Awareness & Research (IHAR) highlights the mainstream narrative of Indian history and discusses the genetic history of India. How did it all begin? Watch this video: http://bit.ly/2a5s5EJ

Rita Raina : I meant there no single truth in 'history'.

Wtf, an electric engineer is a historian who reinterprets history and has started a think-tank? You guys have really lost your marbles. Maybe I should use my political science degree to examine string theory.

Nikhil Joshi we don't yet know for sure if it was an invasion... it could have been simple migration....people did move depending on food and weather. eventually they left Indus area too..didn't they?

Rare Book Society of India Historical facts or events are one....people report it differently. Honestly, the hindu court historian says his King fought the battle and made the muslim invader run....the muslim court historian says his Badshah was victorious and prevalent....I believe the same battle has two outcomes in two hands. Yes?

Raj, I just finished listening to your talk. Thanks RBSI for the link :) It was interesting...I am happy to say you presented it in a true scholarly manner and not religious fanaticism...! Yes I am a hindu too and proud of my ancient roots. All that you talked about has also been my line of research over the last 10-15 yrs, though I never attempted to put a lecture together like you have.....I have been lecturing my family and friends and sometimes on RBSI site too :) Anyway, I would have liked to go beyond the recorded history. Time before Budha. History between the time of IVC and Budha. Did IVC people migrate West to east or the other way round...were they the people who composed Rg Veda? . Must mention here I am glad you used the term migration and stayed away from invasion.....glad you touched the evidence from mitochondrial DNA. Some people needed to know that we all are Africans by root. i am still digesting all the info. BTW, if your birthday happens to be 18th July....then you and I share the same birth date :) and this lecture was a very pleasing gift. Hopefully, I will have the opportunity to talk to you more as I know i am interested in also talking about Tilak's theory. Hope to hear from you.

Rita Raina sure, simple migration. But fact remains that the ethnicities have still not fully dissolved into each other.

Nikhil Joshi....may the certainty that you have in so called facts serve you well. It was once considered factual that earth is flat. In history and most other fields new constructs and frameworks constantly evolve. Good luck in your journey of discovery

Good luck with you inventing history on the other hand.

Nikhil Joshi There is much to be discovered and learned, yet. The archeologists have just dug the tip.

And this blows my mind.....I have experienced it :) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6CQxcRrDR3w

Jay And yet we have flat earthers today. Deja vu?

Rita, we are confusing two things here, facts in isolation and the interpretation of those facts in a larger context. While a single piece of evidence can be dismissed as coincidental, multiple smoking guns are more difficult to. There is more than ample evidence of a people sharing a culture, very similar to the one found in Central Asia around that time, migrating into India over a period. The evidence is not just archaeological, it is linguistic, genetic and literary. A singular overarching framework that explains all these satisfactorily with minimum of assumptions is the Aryan migration theory. Occam's razor wins.

Going off topic a bit, can anyone recommend a book on the history of Africa? Preferably covering the pre-colonial era (and not concentrating on Egypt or Carthage).

hilarious -- and embarassing

For people on both sides of the discussion.....this article shows how Vedantas influenced the great western physicists in the 19th and early 20th centuries.....it also shows they acknowledged the greatness of our ancient thought.....as did the philosophers of west. No leftist conspiracy...... http://upliftconnect.com/quantum-physics-vedas/

Just because some physicists were nutcases, that doesn't count as science endorsing it. Science is an ideology to look at nature, goes beyond mere formulae and hypotheses.

Rita https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confirmation_bias

Adeel Zafar : Applies perfectly to the Marxist versions...actually.

Rare Book Society of India Maybe, but it does perfectly to you.

Nikhil Joshi Its not endorsing anything.....its more like where do ideas pop into the scientists mind from. We can not write off science fiction writers like HG Wells and Jules Verne's influence on modern scientific thought...neither can we write off the influence of Vedic thought. Scientists in NASA are researching the Vimana txt and its ideas....apparently some are worth trying for new fuel etc. However, coming back to indologists, and this for those who believe Europeans purposely messed with interpretation of sanskrit txts, while there might have been a few bad crooked Europeans.....I do not believe there was any big conspiracy going on to defame the Vedas or hindu religion. On the contrary there were amazed with the txts and wanted to find out what was written in them. Any defamation that happened was thanks to our own people...what with thugee and sati and many more awful traditions going on in those days, and some even now. Finally, for those who want to promote the conspiracy theory and rewrite Indian history....I will once again say....kahan tak history ko badloge.....what happened you can not change. Ram Vedam has not answered my question on history beyond Budha, the period of unrecorded history.....he must be busy with lectures :) hopefully soon we will talk about that part of history which is the actual bone of contention. Everything that happened later than Budha, we have a good idea about....It was written down and we know there was flow of information and people, and intermingling, and even inter marriages in BOTH directions.

Rare Book Society of India Not really RBSI, Biased Confirmation applies very well to the Hindutva group as well. There are many things they want to promote about Vedas that I do not agree with.....and Vedas are dear to me too.

PS: About the 40,000 yr old cave paintings in Bhimbetak..... there are 40,000 yr old cave paintings in France too. So, Bhimbetak does not prove humans came to Europe later than and from India.

Actually you should. :)

Good idea. It will turn out highly coherent and will be ground breaking research. At least to you guys.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Polymath

Minhaj Khan : Yes...there is a possibility that it could be! But then, you just closed the door for further enquiry and re-examination by those two simple words - "you guys". :)

'Education System Does not Foster the Spirit of Inquiry' India has a huge population of 1.2 billion, but suffers from a dearth of innovators or scientists. Experts say this could be because the country’s education system hardly encourages students to ask questions. An article by Ravindra P Nettimi from Indian Institute of Science Education and Research (IISER), Pune, Madhur Mangalam from University of Georgia, and Mewa Singh from the University of Mysore, recently published in the journal Current Science talks of the lack of a culture of research in the country’s under-graduate courses. “This is what prevents us from discovering great things,” says Professor Uma Shaanker, scientist and teacher at the Department of Crop Physiology, University of Agricultural Sciences, Bengaluru. City scientists and teachers agree. They say a culture of asking questions and undertaking research would help in the making of innovators. In the article, Mewa Singh says, “Teachers play an important role in stimulating students to raise questions. ” Uma Shaanker says, “Most students in BSc and post-graduate courses have never participated in a journey of discovery. While our students have a lot of knowledge through books, their minds are not trained to ask questions. They then become second-rate scientists.” http://bit.ly/2aprRs2

The leftists, the so called seculars and the Islamists consistently show their colour to any alternate viewpoints. That India was a non-Islamic, non-western landmass prior to 1100 AD seems irrelevant to this group of people. Sarasvathi river, dating of Mahabharatha, questioning AIT, dating of Vedas all these are topics when raised are labelled as saffronization. Left to such people Troy would have been never discovered.

We show our colours to these 'alternate' viewpoints because it is simply trash. Even the most right wing professors of JNU would dump your rubbish thesis's into the dustbin.

“In times of universal deceit, telling the truth is a revolutionary act” George Orwell

Yes, you are right RBSI....So, here's drinking to.....may the TRUTH prevail all biases, especially the political ones...of the modern times as well as the ancient times.